Former Sony Interactive Entertainment boss Shawn Layden is better positioned than most to talk about the impact of the PlayStation brand – he began his career at Sony before the console even existed and would rise to the position of Chairman of SIE Worldwide Studios.
Speaking to Eurogamer to celebrate the 30th anniversary of the PlayStation brand, Layden talked at length on how the project came to be, referencing the infamous SNES PlayStation, which never happened:
We were going to build - or rather, we built - an optical drive peripheral for the Super Nintendo Entertainment System. Nintendo realised cartridges had already maxed out their memory footprints and so we - or rather, Ken Kutaragi - created the compact disc technology to support the SNES. And we were just about ready. I think it was at CES [Computer Entertainment Show] 1993, we were going to announce the partnership. And Nintendo left us standing at the altar, after they did a pivot at the last minute and went with Philips.
Rather than abandon the idea, Kutaragi was bold enough to suggest turning the optical drive into a new games machine that could challenge both Nintendo and Sega:
So there was Ken, proverbially standing at the altar with his optical disc drive in his hands. And, indignant, he went back to the leadership at Sony at the time and said: 'All I need is an OS and some more connecting tissue for this thing, and we can build our own game machine'.
Layden also comments on the famous lack of enthusiasm for video games that came from within Sony:
I think a lot of the leadership at the time didn't take it seriously. They thought: 'Oh my god, Sega and Nintendo own this thing [the console industry]. You think Sony's going to come in sideways and try to divvy that thing up into a three piece pie?' It was a 'fool's errand', I think some of them might have even called it at the time. But [then-Sony president Norio] Ohga-san was a believer. A lot of people thought we were taking a risk. It was a fight to get the Sony name onto the machine - they didn't want to be associated with it.
Layden wasn't part of the Sony Interactive Entertainment team from the very beginning – he joined Sony in 1987 and was working as an assistant to chairman and Sony founder Akio Morita out of the company's Japanese headquarters when the machine was launched – but he vividly remembers the first time he laid eyes on the PlayStation. What was his reaction to seeing Ridge Racer on PS1 for the first time? "Oh my god, this is going to be fucking amazing".
Layden would officially join Sony's Interactive Entertainment division in 1996, after the PlayStation had launched all over the world. Even then, he reveals that some within the company almost enjoyed the fact that they were ripping up the rulebook:
The president of PlayStation at the time was a guy named Terry Tokunaka. We'd worked together on the acquisition of Columbia Pictures, so I was kind of a known quantity. After the chairman's death, Terry asked me 'what are you going to do now? Why don't you come and join us in this new company, Sony Computer Entertainment?' I said, 'Okay, that's great. What would I do there?'
He said: 'You'd be a video game producer'. I said: 'I'll be honest with you, I don't know anything about making video games'. And Terry was very upfront. He said, 'It's all right. None of us do either. This is the perfect time to get in. We'll all make this stuff up as we go along together.'
The full interview is well worth a read. Layden parted company with Sony in 2019 and is currently employed as a strategic advisor at Tencent Games.
[source eurogamer.net]
Comments 29
Still recall the Nintendo CD artist impressions for like 12-24 months from Famitsu, regularly republished in Super Play and EGM during the early to mid 90s plus their own ideas. Sprite scaling as a feature and the promise of expansive amazing Square and Enix RPGs, Super Mario Kart and Pilotwings Sequels and goodness knows what else! I am sure Streetfighter 3 was even name dropped once in the Quartermann section of EGM.
Nintendo went the way of chips as a hardware upgrade in the end, but it was the licensing issues and another platform/hardware manufacturer having control over a Nintendo console that was the biggest sticking point if I recall.
Plus obviously SONY Corporate wanting to pay back the massive slight made to them in public.
Then Nintendo got into bed with Phillips straight after, a Dutch company who were not perceived as a big threat compared to SONY plus apparently they had greater CD experience.
Not a threat at all especially with the games supplied by Nintendo for CDI!
@Deuteros
Sony and Phillips, are the co creators of the CD format.
Nintendo figured they would be well off with the other half of the partnership.
Did that bite them on the ass and then some.
The Playstation was born out of vengeance, fire and fury. ( to be dramatic)
With Nintendo creating their own biggest rival.
Phillips these days is but a shell of their former selves,they don't even do electronics anymore just licence their name out to other companies.
They moved in to medical equipment.
The PlayStation was born from a very early split in the partnership. So it stands to reason that had they launched hardware and then split later because of probable business and creative differences, with Sony making an overture to non-Nintendo, non-Japan developers, that the PlayStation would have eventually existed for Sony anyway.
@KitsuneNight
To be fair, Sony would have gotten its hands on Nintendos IPs.
Even if Nintendo has its biggest Competition with Sony, having lost the IPs would be a bigger Hit and maybe Nintendo as we know wouldn't exist any longer.
Imo the Competition is good, i liked them both (nowadays i dislike them both haha)
@KitsuneNight
Must admit Nintendo's PR and marketing department definitely name dropped Phillips as a more experienced player in terms of CD technology back then I am sure, digging the knife further in no doubt...
But even from a 14 year old fanboy point of view during the early 90s, you could sense something was up with the CD development, especially after Mega CD failed to take off, CDTV, 3DO nosedived, only real uptake initially was PC integration with the likes of 7th Guest.
N64 had the DD, Gamecube had the Gameboy Player, and the Famicom had the Disc system plus SNES had the Satellite concept, so only really the Wii (Did have GC backwards compatability built in I guess on early models) and Wii U plus Switch that did not follow this trend of an add for Nintendo's main system just the last two decades.
A sign of technology becoming more standardised/homogenised and less interesting maybe plus cannabilising their own handheld market..
Yes the Switch has done 150 million units of all types but only one console instead of two now for Nintendo, plus looks like SONY and Microsoft have eyes on the handheld market once again after its success and Steamdeck...
Trying to find the most flamboyent early images or concept pics of SNES CD is tricky even with the internet, it seems, some of the EGM/Famitsu/Super Play ones made it look like a unit from the 21st century that would do the cooking for you as well...
When you think back to the early Sony Imagesoft releases on 16 bit and even many of the early PS1 titles development has certainly come a long way in 30 years.
Plus Skyblazer is bl**dy expensive these days to own on the SNES!
@KitsuneNight Agreed Phillips seem to have totally pulled out of home consumer market now, you see no advertising for them anywhere even at a corporate level.
"In 2021, Philips Domestic Appliances was purchased by Hillhouse Capital for $4.4 billion. The company, now known as Versuni, continues to sell small appliances under the Philips brand under license."
Plus apparently made a 1.6 Billion Euro loss in 2022 alone and cut 10,000 jobs reading their corporate recent history and sold another major stake to remain solvent since then!
@Azuris I am sure there was a major issue with SONY being a Japanese company as well, plus IP rights as you say, like selling the crown jewels to your competitor all for a CD add on that would be gone in <5 years tops and one generation.
Probably worked out best for everyone and allowed the industry to grow overall as well, with another player, although SEGA fans might not think as much for sure!
@Deuteros
Even worse , they shut down their light bulb manufacturing plant.
That may sound odd but they started off manufacturing light bulbs so Phillips scuppering that is them pretty much admitting its over.
The old Phillips is gone and something inferior took their place.
@Azuris
Oh for sure Nintendo was between a rock and a hard place.
But they could have handled it better.
In snubbing Sony, they unleashed their fury, and well the rest is history.
And gamers reaped the benefits of all the great games.
@KitsuneNight Seems to be the way of the world many big companies of the 20th century failing to adapt to the 21st, or forgetting their origins plus bread and butter, or just poorly managed...
@Deuteros
Think its a bit of all of those factors.
The 2009 recession and the pandemic and the mismanagement there sure didn't help either.
But it is what it is.
Also I am a Sega fan.
But Sega had to pull out regardless they were bleeding money in the late 90's had massive debts and a piss poor PR image.
Their situation was untenable.
They only survived because Isao Okawa on his deathbed, forfeit the debt Sega had in loans to him.
Ge also gave the company his entire 700 million dollar fortune, in Sega and CSK stock.
That and them pulling out of the hardware market are the only reasons Sega didn't went the way of Atari.
A zombie brand whose skin is worn by other companies.
@KitsuneNight "A zombie brand whose skin is worn by other companies".
Konami been going that way for a decade now compared to glory years...
@Deuteros
Konami has been on a decade long suicide march.
Then when high on bathsalts they skinned their own face and are now wearing it as a mask.
@Deuteros I loved all those crazy concept images and the rumours about what the hardware would do. I was genuinely quite surprised when the actual SNES CD prototype turned up and it was just a simple CD-ROM drive with no additional capabilities compared to what the Mega-CD had.
“Nintendo realised cartridges had already maxed out their memory footprints“
So as much as I love the N64, this begs the question, why did they stick with cartridges again. They knew what they were up against with the PS1 by this point.
Greed again really I guess because they didn’t want to let go of the model of charging for the production of cartridges.
BTW there are lots of great campaigns pushing sells of the switch on the lead up to Christmas, yet most people with a remote interest in gaming know that early in the new year they will be announcing the successor, sell off that old stock fast before the announcement I guess.
I like Nintendo games and products by the way, these are just observations.
@Bod2019 Do not own a SWITCH looking to steal a new black and white OLED at half price come Easter!
@BulkSlash The anticipation for a new console was really big back then during prints golden era, I liked the artists impressions, plus loads of new hardware, and no net or social media spoiling it all with overindulgence or cynicism.
The rumours and "vaporware", jesus there is a term not heard in a while, may as well apply it to that Sega multi console fraud!
Seeing all the pics or prototypes of new PC Engines, Neo Geos, then the 32 bit machines, the N64 reveal looking like a 1950s radio, NEC 32bit and the Jaguar et.al. Plus even the failures and budget handhelds were interesting plus stuff like Wonderswan and NG Pocket.
Last console felt like this in terms of excitement was Dreamcast/PS2/Gamecube and XBox early 00s era. Final generation felt truly connected to as result of age/time/interest in hobby.
Hardware designs less frequent now and more flat in terms of industrial design...
I genuinely got more excitement buying an original Gameboy Color recently than a 360 or another new Smartphone. Figures.
@Deuteros
The 360 was the last console I was genuinely excited for.
It helped that I got a core console in November 2005.
Somehow I managed to swindle my mom in to getting a Cellphone plan and the 360 came with it.
That was the last time I was an early adopter.
It's always skipped over Sony after Nintendo was in talks with SEGA to made the Saturn.
@KitsuneNight
Actually I forgot about the Nintendo DS, specifically the Lite upgrade around 2004-2006 or whenever it appeared and we got rid of version 1.0, as that was genuinely a game changer and also importantly pre 2008 and Smartphone plus had loads of unique titles. 20 years since that launched though just recently. Scary!
A decade on from Playstation is 2004, then 2014 I am lost as its part of my big gap from gaming from around 2008-2020.
I think some of the immediacy and excitement of the industry has certainly decreased due to very long hardware cycles, software and hardware upgrades via download, and incremental tech gains, then the dilution of 1st party manufacturers in terms of consoles and as importantly all in one computers like the Amiga or the last great one the Acorn Archimedes.
You lost Sega, NEC, SNK gained SONY and Microsoft but also fell by the side were Commodore, 3DO, Atari, Bandai, Acorn, Sinclair, Amstrad and others.
Technology also means less frequent oddities or stand alone curiosities like the Barcode Battler appear these days.
Although I was kind of impressed by a Transformers 40th Anniversary AR Card Game recently but all done on Smartphone. Your smartphone/mini computer does so much and has replaced about a dozen individual devices.
Would probably be impressed by SWITCH due to the diversity and library of content so looking forward to getting stuck into that next year at a glacial pace no doubt.
Only recently completed Link between Worlds and Metroid on 3DS...
So in summation Retro for the win it seems!
@Leynos
There was the awesome Sega corporate archive and history I forget the name Segabase, I think or Sega 16, done by one guy from late 90s.
Somebody has archived it written May 2000 and updated in 2001.
Here is the Saturn link.
https://www.atani-software.net/segabase/SegaBase-Saturn(Part1).html
Scroll down to the Playstation CD section it explains everything on this topic in detail, three sides to it as always, two perspectives and the truth. It was a licensing issue as Sony wanted anybody to sell games on it and Hiroshi Yamauchi thought this was against Nintendo's strict content control and ethos. Very detailed info on whole breakdown. Yet interesting ramifications for delay of Nintendo's next console.
Seriouly this guy Sam Pettus should have written an entire book on SEGA and all hardware manufacturers afterwards his stuff was lightyears ahead of anybody back then...
Recall reading all of it nearly in early 00s and it was fascinating and totally comprehensive, as good as a book, and totally detailed for early 21st Century, plus this was fresh just out of the Dreamcast death.
He had sections on Early Sega, Japanese Consoles, Master System, Megadrive, Saturn and Dreamcast, plus loads of Corporate intrigue and stuff on the behind the scenes split between Sega USA, and Japan the Neptune, plus Saturn development and also Game Gear then Nomad plus worldwide iterations in South America, basically everything.
I recall this SONY/SEGA pact was maybe touched on but if anyone has a working link to something more up to date please share. Would not mind reading this over again.
Reminds me of one other great Industry what ifs, Microsoft to buy SEGA, that seemed to be nearly fact at the end of Dreamcast's life circa 2000/2001.
Here is the section copyright 2000 Sam Pettus...
The SegaBase Article explains everything regarding this split.
Back in 1988, Nintendo had contracted Sony to develop a "Super Disc" drive for the 16-bit SNES. This device would later be revealed to the world as the SNES PlayStation, or just PlayStation for short. Nintendo's intent had been to ship the system's CD-ROMs inside a custom caddy complete with an SNES-style lockout chip - a convoluted approach that would have ensured it retained control over the process. Sony understandably balked at this idea - it wanted to put the lockout chip in the CD-ROM drive controller, inside the console, and leave the games alone. This move would also open up the production process, and Sony quitely made plans to license production of PlayStation games to anybody they wanted. Sony president Olaf Olaffson first announced the PlayStation at the 1991 Summer Consumer Electronics Show (CES) in Chicago, proudly proclaiming that "... Sony intends to broadly license it to the [whole] software industry]." This was anathema to Nintendo CEO Hiroshi Yamauchi, who had no intention of letting Nintendo losing control over any part of the process. He conspired with Sony's rival Philips to publically humiliate Sony the following day at the show. In a public press conference held at 9:00 am sharp, Nintendo's Howard Lincoln announced that it had instead signed a deal with Philips for its new CD-ROM system. The stated reason? Since Philips had invented CD-ROM technology, it could offer superior workmanship. The real reason? Nintendo refused to relinquish control of any part of its proprietary hardware. If Nintendo was going to release a CD-ROM based console on the market, then people would have to come to Nintendo to license it - not some ambitious third-party licensee. "Nintendo believes in a standard - our standard," Yamauchi later said of the affair. Sony saw it differently. "They stabbed us in the back," Olaffson told one of his confidants. The resultant legal and technical hopscotch that Nintendo would be forced to play over the affair pretty much assured that it would not be able to bring a decent CD-ROM system to market in time to ride the crest of the 32-bit wave. Instead, they would have to develop a completely new system from the ground up, launch it after everybody else's systems had already hit the market, and pray that their marketing prowess and company's public reputation would sell the new system for them. Nintendo was unconcerned, though - they thought they had derailed Sony's ambitions for good and went blithely ahead with making money. They were wrong ... quite wrong.
I remember seeing the SNES Play Station at PRGE a few years ago such an awesome feeling to be that close to a piece of video game history.
Oh man Pettus has kickstarted a book on SEGA from 2013 I missed available on Amazon, makes total sense, he was excellent at this, really one of the early pioneers of Detailed Corporate Video Game History.
SERVICE GAMES THE RISE AND FALL OF SEGA ENHANCED EDITION - 500 PAGES
You need to interview him Time Extension like now!
Here it is...
New Edition! More content, images, and corrected text and facts. Monochrome edition.Starting with its humble beginnings in the 1950's and ending with its swan-song, the Dreamcast, in the early 2000’s, this is the complete history of Sega as a console maker. Before home computers and video game consoles, before the internet and social networking, and before motion controls and smartphones, there was Sega. Destined to fade into obscurity over time, Sega would help revolutionize and change video games, computers and how we interact with them, and the internet as we know it. Riding the cutting edge of technology at every step, only to rise too close to the sun and plummet, Sega would eventually change the face of entertainment, but it’s the story of how it got there that’s all the fun. So take a ride, experience history, and enjoy learning about one of the greatest and most influential companies of all time. Complete with system specifications, feature and marketing descriptions, unusual factoids, almost 300 images, and now enhanced Europe specific details, exclusive interviews, and more make this the definitive history of Sega available. Read and learn about the company that holds a special place in every gamer’s heart. Funded on Kickstarter.
Just ordered as an early Christmas present.
@Bod2019
Looks like Nintendo stuck with Cartridges for propriety control as was reported at time, plus speed so no loading times, cost of CD drives shifting, but also and maybe most importantly any impending legal fallout from the failed Playstation CD SNES add on was also a huge factor, this element I have not seen reported a great deal at all through decades...
Nintendo spited them and lead to the birth of the Playstation, SEGA showed them the value of 3D gaming with Virtua Fighter so they fully locked into a 3D console.....strange how things worked out
Squaresoft USA had a short lived newsletter they sent out, one issue of which had a short write up of what we could expect from RPGs on CD-ROM via the eventual sfc/snes cd attachment.
I’m still salty it never happened.
@Deuteros do you remember , or did you ever see, the squaresoft newsletter talking about it? Not sure if you’re American. I must have read that newsletter 90 times. It was even more speculative than quarterman, but I was like 10 years old so… 😝 I still get excited thinking about the snes with a cd drive, and the beefier 2D hardware, rather than the 3D-athon the PS ended up (especially in the US, where Bernie stollar opposed any 2D games from being localized)
UK here mainly in youth, got first EGM the Summer CES one with Batman Returns on cover in Los Angeles then Ziff Davis started distributing them abroad around later of that year.
No Squaresoft European Software arm in those days but got Final Fantasy 2 , 3, and Secret of Mana myself as had US SNES.
UK only got Mana, and likes of Illusion of Gaia and Terranigma plus Mystic Quest, maybe a few select others, as so many languages for continent back in those days to translate hence expensive and time consuming.
Square Newsletter sounds pretty cool, would like to see scans, do not recall too much of Square and Enix plans for SNES CD other than expanded RPGs, I think maybe Mana/Mana 2 was originally developed for CD but could be mixing things up...
Missed out on the Playstation era mostly with Square and Enix but caught up through backward compatability with PS2 on some, as waited for N64, not too many RPGs in the end for that console unfortunately, but at least there was Ocarina!
Going to do some research to see just what titles were announced for SNES CD tonight.
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