Kalmaro

Not really that interested, I can kinda see the interest that.

Didn't play too many shmup games growing up and this was kinda before my time too.

Still, that's some interesting history behind all of this.

@First_Amendment No

@Damo Hmm? No one has pointed that out to me, I appreciate you expanding on your reasoning for making the article though. It would be nice if we got more Sega classics.

@Jokerwolf You say that but I can see other Nintendo sites with news right now, like the direct happening soon.

@ramu-chan But it's "Nintendo" Life, shouldn't the stuff be about Nintendo?

And perhaps this article is, in not seeing the connection though,

@Damo I promise this isn't a criticism, I was just hoping for clarification on how this is Nintendo-related.

I'm with @BustahWolf, I don't see the connection between this and Nintendo. Maybe there's just something I'm missing?

For a moment, I thought the crank was to help recharge the device.

@montiedragon Your comment is noted. Not much else to say, this topic is pretty old and I don't have the same stance anymore.

@deABREU It is stealing of its not yours to begin with. You don't own the car, you don't own the game you're copying.

Nor are you entitled to the game or car.

Brings me back to my days of playing games after school as a kid. Well, it makes me think about those days anyway. Used to love playing SoR2 all day. Could never beat it though haha.

@beautifulstrong Well, one of those is an actual law, the others are more of a tradition. I'm sure you can see the difference.

Looks fascinating really.

Not sure what you're referring to. You're a bit late the conversation.

Sad to say I've never heard of them, my condolences to the family though.

I'd still stick with switch. More convenient.

@Fearful-Octopus I'm shocked they haven't tried already.

Just port Sega's heritage to Switch :U

@goombastomper85 No one is taking you seriously with an attitude like that. Why do you keep responding? I've already said I'm done with this topic, and you're basically just harassing me by this point. If that's all you plan to do to people they will ignore you.

@goombastomper85 I think you may want to take some time to slow down, take a breath, and read what I said.

I said I'm done talking about this for now. While you're wait, perhaps you can look for where I said anything about copying music being legal or not.

I used to when I was younger but can't say I copy CDs anymore. Haven't done that in years. Regardless, if something is illegal it doesn't matter if either of us do it, just means we're both in the wrong.

This topic is kinda old so I'm going to just let it go, but I do appreciate you're willingness to still discuss it.

@Hughesy I never said I wasn't interested in the article. Just that it is too long. So I didn't read it. Shouldn't assume so much.

@Hughesy Your point?

Too long, didn't read.

It will fail I bet, but not because of the design. That is one good looking console.

@KawlunDram Just going with what you said. I already mentioned above that I'm done with this for the moment. Got work in the morning anyway. It's too late to be getting into legal debates.

@KawlunDram I'd imagine you'd have a point, in 50 years then.

@ClampedDownHard For someone who doesn't care you sure seem to care a lot.

@roadrunner343 I'm not an idiot, I know what they will say if I ask if copying a game is bad. Give me some credit.

If it sounds like I'm lazy it's probably due to it being the weekend and being kinda tired of talking about this. I need to make dinner and pizza is more interesting then reading through legal documents on a Sunday.

I do appreciate your willingness to provide me with material to go through though.

Even if a EULA did not exist for an older game there is still the copyright to consider, as the owner of it is the only one who has the right to copy and distribute their material. There's no way to get around it, no one legally can copy a Nintendo game still owned by Nintendo. I've talked with Nintendo's legal team before but it was about an emulation site. I'll send an email about this and hopefully get this cleared up.

@roadrunner343 That was just an example, they have that on all of their stuff. EULAs have been shown to hold up in court. So yes, my argument stands. These games people are dumping do not belong to anyone but the developer.

@roadrunner343 I don't know about other game companies but Nintendo makes it very clear that you are not purchasing their games, just a license to play them.

http://simpleeulas.weebly.com/nintendo-eula.html

Hence me saying they people can not make roms legally. No one has that authority, except Nintendo.

@roadrunner343 What you are basically saying is that people have no obligation for justifying why they can take the property of someone else and make copies of it for their own use.

I wasn't aware that I would have to show why this is wrong, especially considering that we do not own the games we buy, just the right to play them. Unless we are talking about abandonware.

@WaxxyOne Would you mind proving that owners of older software have the right to back up and make copies of any older game they choose?

@KawlunDram when you can show me a ruling that says we have the authority to make backups of games that belong to someone else, play backups of games that we don't own, or any other excuse that you can think of breaking the rules, let me know.

And while you're at it, feel free to find some ruling that gives anyone the right to chose over the developer's head who still own the games, which games should be preserved.

@Leej07 "should" apply you say but it doesn't does it?

I agree, I wish the Supreme Court would make a decision about this.

I feel like articles like this pop up when sites either need ad revenue or they just want to see the comments section melt down.

@Onion
If something is illegal it does make it wrong, in the absence of some higher ruling that says otherwise. Especially if you live in the area that has such a ruling. Just because Nintendo and their lawyers are not knocking down doors and scanning everyone's computers and checking for ROM devices does not mean it is okay. That sounds like that argument you hear people say sometimes "it's only illegal if you get caught!"

The reason I care is because I have to, I support laws that protect developers, especially as I want to be one eventually. Even more, I also believe that laws can not just be bent when they become inconvenient.

My argument for the longest now has been that if someone does not have the authority to make a copy of a game, then making one is breaking rules. I have yet to have anyone refute that. Now, if it could be proven that when we purchase a game we actually own 'the game' and not just the right to play it then I'll drop my case. If we do own the game then I can't see a problem with doing whatever you really want with it. It's yours. I've yet to see anything to say this is true though.

But hey, we ultimately are going back and forth because we have differing standards. I see laws as something to be followed unless a higher ruling says otherwise, you see laws as something to be followed unless you don't like them. That is why we can't come to an agreement.

@Leej07
When it comes to fair use I read, from the article:
"might be"
" fuzzy standard"
"potential legal argument."

And they admit that "Nintendo could argue that by emulating the game on your phone, instead of buying their official port of a game, they’re losing money."

Now that covers games still being sold.

When it comes to games you own he still stays vague and when it comes to making a case they says things like:

They "could imagine" this being the same as fair use though admits that "optics are different." they also point out the the person asked "doesn’t think the two situations are all that distinct, legally speaking."

That it is "probably not" any different from downloading a ROM

They then end it by saying "If we assume, for a moment, that if I did that it would be fair use, then it shouldn’t be different.” but earlier point out that they are not exactly sure if this falls under fair use.

Now, when it comes to games no longer on the market they make a point that I myself have considered from time to time. If we want to buy a game that no longer is sold then i can understand someone trying to make the argument that they should be able to get said game. However, that argument will fail if the game is still owned by the company. Not to mention if a company is like Disney and does something like what the person interviewed says

"Disney’s strategy is to put classic movies “in the vault” for extended periods. Instead of leaving films constantly on the market, they periodically re-release them, which builds up demand and increases sales when that release actually comes.

Video game companies could argue they’re doing the same thing with currently unreleased games, and that ROMs are driving down the potential market value. “It’s a close case,” says Bambauer, “and hasn’t been tested a lot.” But they could make that argument."

I think that is a fair point. If a company has long term goals for a game and people are actively making copies and taking away potential capital from said company, a case can most likely be made there.

In the end they admit that this is all hypothetical. Nintendo has made a stance on how they feel on ROMs but so far, no one seems to have challenged them on it and video games in general. That's what I got from this site and no where does it say it is fair use to make a copy of a game you own. Just that hypothetically you could but no one has challenged it and thus, we have a case of Nintendo saying no and gamers saying yes. At the end of the day though, Nintendo owns the game you are purchasing.

@Leej07 Once again, where is that proven anywhere that you can make a backup of a game you purchased?

People keep getting on my case about being a "broken record" and never stop to consider that, maybe I keep repeating myself because they themselves have not refuted what I have said :/

Until someone can prove that we can make copies of games we purchase then I kinda have to keep repeating myself. I'm not saying anything else on the matter either. You cm guys are free to have your opinions and I won't argue with them. I only have issues if those opinions are presented as fact and you have nothing to back them up.

Until someone finally answers my point, have a good day everyone.

@Chozo85 I don't own morality and I don't claim to. All I've down is use common sense. It does not matter if a game is not being sold or not. If it is still the property of the company or group that made it and there is no ruling saying you cannot make copies of a game then I do not see what ground you have to stand on.

My personal opinions have nothing to do with any of this. If I had it my way then games would be free since I can't afford all of them. That's not how things work though. Everyone seems intent on making this about my opinions when I have made a point of leaving them out of this.

@Darknyht Do you? That actually sounds pretty cool. It is a shame that you can't play them normally. If they are fan made can't you just play them on an emulator?

@Ralek85 I've mentioned this in another comment but my point was that they often cast roms in a positive light when ROMs themselves have never been proven as legal. Evidence suggest that they are illegal in almost all cases as the games themselves do not belong to the consumer.

@Onion let me get this straight. When it comes to ROMs you say both:
"we know it's illegal." and
" At the end of the day, roms are not evil"

This is kinda why we can't agree on anything. If something is illegal then it is wrong but then you say it is not wrong.

@liveswired If you can show me where there is a ruling stating that owning a physical copy of a game that is the property of another company, I will drop all of my arguments.

@Chozo85 You'd buy it off ebay, I'm not seeing what the confusion is. The game has been paid for and the person is transferring it to you so now you can play the game. I don't see how that is related to ROMS at all. This isn't about buying used games, it's about making copies.

This whole "I'm just old enough to... Etc" argument you are making does not hold water. Rules do not apply until they are inconvenient. That's not how these things work.

@electrolite77 All I'm hearing from you are various forms of entitlement. This all boils down to dealing with something that belongs to someone else. If the game you want belongs to the company still and the only thing you buy is the right to just play said game, then making copies of it is not on a grey area. You are not authorized to do so.

@Chozo85 I've already said earlier that if a game is not currently owned by anyone then there is no issue. This issue is about ROMS for games that are still owned by a company.

@electrolite77 I could say the same to you, you seem convinced that ROMs are a grey area but I see nothing to suggest that. I can garuntee you that if you try to take it to court against Nintendo you would lose every time.

@AlwaysGreener Yeah, that's a situation that isn't bad since the who issue is about dealing with someone's property. If no one owns the game then it doesn't really matter.

@electrolite77 When did this become about all rules? I'm just talking about roms. Anything else is off topic. This is not as grey as you think

@AlwaysGreener If a company no longer has rights to a game then there shouldn't be a problem, it doesn't belong to anyone then.

@Switch81tch If the property still belongs to someone then theres nothing you can do. If no one owns it then there's no need to ask for permission.

@Leej07 I have no problem with preserving things, provided people have the authority to do so. You show me the rule that says that all games must be preserved no matter what and you will have made your point.

@Leej07 That is false, there is no rule that says that any time you buy anything, it is yours.

@Leej07 Like I was telling another guy, I've been called worse. You're entire argument hinges on the idea that "Games must be preserved". However, you don't have the authority to make that call now do you? There is no rule saying that anyone deserves to play any game, that's just entitlement talking.

I hate that I don't have access to every game I played as a kid but that's just life.