@Porco Thankfully, TINK4K can give you a plethora of CRT filters/Shaders to replicate that CRT softness with some mild scan lines. It's really the motion clarity of OLED/QD-OLED that i can't stand, and while TINK4K does a good job at removing at least 50% of it with it's internal BFI, you'll have to deal with 2x the input lag. It's a lose lose situation in my eyes, at this point. Settle for 100% OLED motion blur(UGH!) at a responsive 10ms of lag, or deal with 50%(which make a big difference BTW) blur at around 20ms of lag? You're basically trading button response/delay for much greater motion clarity.
CRT's have zero motion blur and pretty much no input lag. I can't wait for the day when a future TINK4K + CRT simulation can finally brute force 960hz-1000hz into future OLED(Whatever) displays, so we can finally get CRT blur-free motion clarity when gaming at 60fps for retro video games and Modern.
But i hear ya! It's nice having a smaller modern QD-OLED/OLED on the side with a TINK4K and retro consoles hooked up to it, on the side, to go along with your CRT. it's fun to compare the two, just to see the differences in picture quality. Both have their strengths and weakness after all.
@Porco
An OLED + TINK4K still can't compete with Blur free CRT motion clarity, and zero latency.
Even with TINK4K Black frame insertion, on lets say a 32" 240hz QD-OLED monitor. You're cutting down 75% of the motion blur, which is fantastic, but you'll be dealing with around a frame of lag(16ms), and then about 19ms on a 144hz OLED TV. 16ms is pretty decent, but not as quite responsive or on the dime as a CRT. And regular WOLED colour can't compete with CRT colour either. You'll need QD-OLED for that, but they don't make them in 42". 48" i think this year if we're lucky, and 32" for monitors.
On the flip side, smaller QD-OLED's compared to CRT's, are slim, light weight, have perfect blacks, higher brightness, they're readily available and new, plus progressive scan for PS Standard def based consoles like GameCube & Wii. It's just the motion clarity and input lag(With TINK4K BFI that is) won't be able to compete with CRT. TINK4K's CRT filters are a MUST too when using older consoles on OLED. I cannot stand razor sharp squarey' pixelated graphics. they look ugly and artifical. That soft composite standard deft CRT resolution is what blends those sprites into art.
I'm going with the original TINK4K. This newer model lacks the features for proper 'triple strobe Black frame insertion' which is designed for Movies/TV(24-30fps) content. It basically will remove 64% of your QD-OLED/OLED TV's motion blur if it's 165hz, 58% if it's 144hz, or 50% if it's 120hz. While removing more film judder than both plasma and CRT without incorporating any funky SOE. It's a MUST.
It's capped at 1080p, but that's perfectly fine at 55 - 65". With noticeably less visable BFI flicks with the following above setting compared to the harshness of internal OLED 60hz BFI too. Although, this setting supposedly introduces occasional image artifacts.
Not sure i would use this for gaming, because of the total amount of latency. IF the following below is correct with lets say a 144hz OLED/QD-OLED TV >
2ms lag - (Just by using Tink4K + Frame Lock) 6.94ms lag - ('144hz' TINK4K BFI) 10ms - (From your QD-OLED/OLED TV's game mode at 60fps)
that's basically 19ms total, unless my lag numbers are wrong. That's almost double the amount of latency without TINK4K BFI. Don't get me wrong, a 58% motion blur reduction makes a world of a difference. It looks wonderful. I mean really, without BFI, OLED motion clarity is poor if you've grown accustomed to CRT and even plasma, the better plasmas that is.
If the lag were lower than 1 frame/16ms I could get on board, but I'm assuming that would require your TV to have more hz. a 240hz OLED Monitor with TINK4K not only will remove 75%(Which surpasses even the best plasmas) of OLED motion blur, but i'm guessing it only adds 4ms(It's exact motion persistence) instead of nearly 7ms with a 144hz OLED.
Too bad 240hz QD-OLED 'TV's' don't exist. These TV manufactures are spoon feeding us with the hz.
So what exactly is it doing gameplay-wise that we haven't already seen before? People are so quick to jump on board the hype train because of it's T2 branding and decent sprite art/animation. Looks like something that could of released on PS1 & Saturn.
@jamess
The Switch Pro Controller is notorious for it's high input lag. it has 12ms more lag, than the joy-cons for crying out loud. I'd love to replace it with something like this if it were to ever gain Switch compatibility.
The Pro's D-pad accuracy is kind of mediocre when it comes to playing fighting games, although it feels miles better to the touch than that horrible detached-styled rubbery feeling concaved D-pad from the DualSense. That's the DualSense only real weakness, aside from it's ugly design. The trick is to spend $250 CAD and get the 30th Anniversary Edition. lol But that doesn't solve it's awful feeling d-pad.
@BionicDodo
That would be my second choice, with Astal taking top spot.
It was such a stunning looking and sounding platformer back in the mid 90's. I'm assuming it's already available through Saturn 'MiSTer'.
Not too thrilled about the Composite & Component ports being placed on the sides like that. It's like a double-whammy version of the NES composite cable dangling off the side of the console-situation all over again. They should of just used 1 port on the back that's compatible with Composite/S-video & Component.
Either way, still tempting. It's either this, or a MiSTer Pi once they're back in stock.
@FPGAguru
So what exactly would even be the point of this thing if one already owns a MiSTer or MiSTer Pi?
I could just buy a PS1 SNAX controller adapter and MiSTer pI and call it a day. I guess the Appeal with PS1 FPGA is that it uses actual PS1 memory cards and may provide disc compatibility with a separate attachment? Then there's it's modern-esque PS1 design, instead of being a small trasnparent box which sucks has zero nostalgia or authenticity.
With MiSTer Pi, i would just surround it with older consoles, like NES, SNES, GEN(Etc) to give off the illusion as if I'm nearly playing on the real thing.
@wiiware
PS1 games on PS5 have emulation lag, and I can never get them to look quite right...Even with the available picture & Filter settings) as they did on a 90's CRT when i originally played these games.
Another big problem, is that you can't scale down the image to a size that's better suited for PS1 games(like a 27" or 32" 4:3 CRT). I have a 65" OLED TV, and PS1 games do not look god in 4:3 that big. Same thing applies to the 8-16 bit consoles that came before it.
A PS1(or this new PS1 FPGA), using composite cables, paired with a 27" Sony WEGA Trintiron CRT SDTV will most likely be the best combination, and for those wanting a more modern set up, a smaller QD-OLED via HDMI. You'll gain perfect blacks and higher brightness, but motion clarity will be nowhere near as good. And if this new PS1 FPGA console doesn't offer CRT softness & Scanline settings, to get that 90's CRT look that we all remember, than you'll have to get a RetroTINK 5x Pro or 4K to get the job done.
But eh, the PS1, in most cases just doesn't hold up. I think a lot of our excitement comes from the memories. Because when push comes to shove, i think many of us will pop in a game for 15 minutes and that will be the end of it. 3D polygon games have aged worse than the Chester Cheeto's nesting under my sofa. lol Thankfully, Mega Man 8, X4, Rayman, Castlevania SOTN(etc) have all aged like fine wine. That's the power of beautiful cartoony 32-bit sprites, as long as they're not razor sharp in HD. Need that CRT 480i softness.
Tempting. But I'll be disappointed if it doesn't come equipped with a Scanline depth slider(like the AVS) and CRT Softness settings to get the a similar look to lets say a 1995 Sony CRT TV, on something like a smaller QD-OLED TV.
If not, you'll have to spend $500-$1000 CAD on either a RetroTink 5x Pro or 4K to get the job done.
I'd also love to see them take on a new NES FPGA console.
Make it small, top loading, have a cartridge eject button, HDMI and an Analogue Port(Composite, S-Video & Component for CRT TV's), An ON/OFF custom controller button combination(if possible.) and CRT & Scanline depth slider options. That would be the modern NES dweam'.
Comments 12
Re: The Must-Have RetroTINK 4K Upscaler Now Has A Cheaper Alternative
@Porco
Thankfully, TINK4K can give you a plethora of CRT filters/Shaders to replicate that CRT softness with some mild scan lines. It's really the motion clarity of OLED/QD-OLED that i can't stand, and while TINK4K does a good job at removing at least 50% of it with it's internal BFI, you'll have to deal with 2x the input lag. It's a lose lose situation in my eyes, at this point. Settle for 100% OLED motion blur(UGH!) at a responsive 10ms of lag, or deal with 50%(which make a big difference BTW) blur at around 20ms of lag? You're basically trading button response/delay for much greater motion clarity.
CRT's have zero motion blur and pretty much no input lag. I can't wait for the day when a future TINK4K + CRT simulation can finally brute force 960hz-1000hz into future OLED(Whatever) displays, so we can finally get CRT blur-free motion clarity when gaming at 60fps for retro video games and Modern.
But i hear ya! It's nice having a smaller modern QD-OLED/OLED on the side with a TINK4K and retro consoles hooked up to it, on the side, to go along with your CRT. it's fun to compare the two, just to see the differences in picture quality. Both have their strengths and weakness after all.
Re: The Must-Have RetroTINK 4K Upscaler Now Has A Cheaper Alternative
@Porco
An OLED + TINK4K still can't compete with Blur free CRT motion clarity, and zero latency.
Even with TINK4K Black frame insertion, on lets say a 32" 240hz QD-OLED monitor. You're cutting down 75% of the motion blur, which is fantastic, but you'll be dealing with around a frame of lag(16ms), and then about 19ms on a 144hz OLED TV. 16ms is pretty decent, but not as quite responsive or on the dime as a CRT. And regular WOLED colour can't compete with CRT colour either. You'll need QD-OLED for that, but they don't make them in 42". 48" i think this year if we're lucky, and 32" for monitors.
On the flip side, smaller QD-OLED's compared to CRT's, are slim, light weight, have perfect blacks, higher brightness, they're readily available and new, plus progressive scan for PS Standard def based consoles like GameCube & Wii. It's just the motion clarity and input lag(With TINK4K BFI that is) won't be able to compete with CRT. TINK4K's CRT filters are a MUST too when using older consoles on OLED. I cannot stand razor sharp squarey' pixelated graphics. they look ugly and artifical. That soft composite standard deft CRT resolution is what blends those sprites into art.
Re: The Must-Have RetroTINK 4K Upscaler Now Has A Cheaper Alternative
I'm going with the original TINK4K. This newer model lacks the features for proper 'triple strobe Black frame insertion' which is designed for Movies/TV(24-30fps) content. It basically will remove 64% of your QD-OLED/OLED TV's motion blur if it's 165hz, 58% if it's 144hz, or 50% if it's 120hz. While removing more film judder than both plasma and CRT without incorporating any funky SOE. It's a MUST.
It's capped at 1080p, but that's perfectly fine at 55 - 65". With noticeably less visable BFI flicks with the following above setting compared to the harshness of internal OLED 60hz BFI too. Although, this setting supposedly introduces occasional image artifacts.
Not sure i would use this for gaming, because of the total amount of latency. IF the following below is correct with lets say a 144hz OLED/QD-OLED TV >
2ms lag - (Just by using Tink4K + Frame Lock)
6.94ms lag - ('144hz' TINK4K BFI)
10ms - (From your QD-OLED/OLED TV's game mode at 60fps)
that's basically 19ms total, unless my lag numbers are wrong. That's almost double the amount of latency without TINK4K BFI. Don't get me wrong, a 58% motion blur reduction makes a world of a difference. It looks wonderful. I mean really, without BFI, OLED motion clarity is poor if you've grown accustomed to CRT and even plasma, the better plasmas that is.
If the lag were lower than 1 frame/16ms I could get on board, but I'm assuming that would require your TV to have more hz. a 240hz OLED Monitor with TINK4K not only will remove 75%(Which surpasses even the best plasmas) of OLED motion blur, but i'm guessing it only adds 4ms(It's exact motion persistence) instead of nearly 7ms with a 144hz OLED.
Too bad 240hz QD-OLED 'TV's' don't exist. These TV manufactures are spoon feeding us with the hz.
Re: Terminator 2D: No Fate Is "The T2 Game We Should Have Had Back In Our Youth"
So what exactly is it doing gameplay-wise that we haven't already seen before? People are so quick to jump on board the hype train because of it's T2 branding and decent sprite art/animation. Looks like something that could of released on PS1 & Saturn.
Re: 8BitDo Has Announced The Successor To Its Ultimate Wireless Controller
@jamess
The Switch Pro Controller is notorious for it's high input lag. it has 12ms more lag, than the joy-cons for crying out loud. I'd love to replace it with something like this if it were to ever gain Switch compatibility.
The Pro's D-pad accuracy is kind of mediocre when it comes to playing fighting games, although it feels miles better to the touch than that horrible detached-styled rubbery feeling concaved D-pad from the DualSense. That's the DualSense only real weakness, aside from it's ugly design. The trick is to spend $250 CAD and get the 30th Anniversary Edition. lol But that doesn't solve it's awful feeling d-pad.
Re: 3DO Is Coming To MiSTer FPGA
@KimRuggeri
Do you think Dreamcast will be doable on MiSTer in the next few years?
Re: City Connection's Next 'Saturn Tribute' Title Will Be Announced This Week
@BionicDodo
That would be my second choice, with Astal taking top spot.
It was such a stunning looking and sounding platformer back in the mid 90's. I'm assuming it's already available through Saturn 'MiSTer'.
Re: Here's Your Best Look Yet At Taki Udon's SuperStation One FPGA PS1, And You Can Order It Now
Not too thrilled about the Composite & Component ports being placed on the sides like that. It's like a double-whammy version of the NES composite cable dangling off the side of the console-situation all over again. They should of just used 1 port on the back that's compatible with Composite/S-video & Component.
Either way, still tempting. It's either this, or a MiSTer Pi once they're back in stock.
Re: 3DO Is Coming To MiSTer FPGA
And I'm guessing Dreamcast just isn't possible at this point? N64 is basically where it ends for MiSTer?
Re: Interview: Taki Udon Explains How His FPGA PS1 Aims To "Remove Barriers" To FPGA Gaming
@FPGAguru
So what exactly would even be the point of this thing if one already owns a MiSTer or MiSTer Pi?
I could just buy a PS1 SNAX controller adapter and MiSTer pI and call it a day. I guess the Appeal with PS1 FPGA is that it uses actual PS1 memory cards and may provide disc compatibility with a separate attachment? Then there's it's modern-esque PS1 design, instead of being a small trasnparent box which sucks has zero nostalgia or authenticity.
With MiSTer Pi, i would just surround it with older consoles, like NES, SNES, GEN(Etc) to give off the illusion as if I'm nearly playing on the real thing.
Re: Interview: Taki Udon Explains How His FPGA PS1 Aims To "Remove Barriers" To FPGA Gaming
@wiiware
PS1 games on PS5 have emulation lag, and I can never get them to look quite right...Even with the available picture & Filter settings) as they did on a 90's CRT when i originally played these games.
Another big problem, is that you can't scale down the image to a size that's better suited for PS1 games(like a 27" or 32" 4:3 CRT). I have a 65" OLED TV, and PS1 games do not look god in 4:3 that big. Same thing applies to the 8-16 bit consoles that came before it.
A PS1(or this new PS1 FPGA), using composite cables, paired with a 27" Sony WEGA Trintiron CRT SDTV will most likely be the best combination, and for those wanting a more modern set up, a smaller QD-OLED via HDMI. You'll gain perfect blacks and higher brightness, but motion clarity will be nowhere near as good. And if this new PS1 FPGA console doesn't offer CRT softness & Scanline settings, to get that 90's CRT look that we all remember, than you'll have to get a RetroTINK 5x Pro or 4K to get the job done.
But eh, the PS1, in most cases just doesn't hold up. I think a lot of our excitement comes from the memories. Because when push comes to shove, i think many of us will pop in a game for 15 minutes and that will be the end of it. 3D polygon games have aged worse than the Chester Cheeto's nesting under my sofa. lol Thankfully, Mega Man 8, X4, Rayman, Castlevania SOTN(etc) have all aged like fine wine. That's the power of beautiful cartoony 32-bit sprites, as long as they're not razor sharp in HD. Need that CRT 480i softness.
Re: Interview: Taki Udon Explains How His FPGA PS1 Aims To "Remove Barriers" To FPGA Gaming
Tempting. But I'll be disappointed if it doesn't come equipped with a Scanline depth slider(like the AVS) and CRT Softness settings to get the a similar look to lets say a 1995 Sony CRT TV, on something like a smaller QD-OLED TV.
If not, you'll have to spend $500-$1000 CAD on either a RetroTink 5x Pro or 4K to get the job done.
I'd also love to see them take on a new NES FPGA console.
Make it small, top loading, have a cartridge eject button, HDMI and an Analogue Port(Composite, S-Video & Component for CRT TV's), An ON/OFF custom controller button combination(if possible.) and CRT & Scanline depth slider options. That would be the modern NES dweam'.